Episode Six with Chris Jones from tea boy and cameraman to presenter, sock designer, Non Exec Director, podcaster, event host and walking guide

Chris Jones had a eureka moment at university when he discovered the joys of being a cameraman while studying for a media degree. Suddenly and unexpectedly made redundant during the pandemic, he now uses his natural ability to build relationships in his work as a podcaster, event host, charity ambassador, Non-Exec Director, and walking guide.

Starting as a tea boy and runner, his journey took him all around the world filming for sports programmes like Grandstand and World of Sport and including following the British Bobsleigh team, a commitment which ultimately cost him his first marriage.

A chance conversation born from his spirit of helpfulness while filming in St Moritz one day took him from behind the camera to in front of it. Little did he know that it would lead to a career spanning just sort of 30 years as the face of the weather on S4C, the Welsh language television channel. His media profile led to other opportunities as part of his portfolio career including an approach by sock manufacturer, Corgi who worked with him to design a range of household ware as well as weather-themed socks that have sold all around the world including to Justin Trudeau, the Canadian Prime Minister.

All was going well until 2020, when he was hit by three things: the loss of his radio show; a prostate cancer diagnosis, and the unforeseen blow of being made redundant.

Listen to his remarkable story as he overcame the challenges he faced through talking, walking, and singing his way to rebuild his career as a podcast and event host, presenter, charity ambassador and Non-Exec Director, as well as developing a new Welsh well-being walking business.

Chris can be contacted via:
Website: www.chrisjones.cymru

Twitter: https://twitter.com/CTywydd 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100057519495922
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/christywydd_welshweatherman/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-jones-90865689/

SHOW REFERENCES:
Cool Runnings – the epic story of the Jamaican bobsleigh team and their Olympic quest

Elizabeth Kubler-Ross Grief/Change Model– a proven and effective approach for dealing with any form of loss

The Japanese art of Kintsugi

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Transcript

A conversation with Chris Jones Weatherman

[00:00:00] Carolyn: We all have a story. Sometimes it's a story we choose and sometimes it's a story we fall into. That choice can either work for us or against us. Now, according to experts, Gallup, on average, we spend 81,396 hours at work over the course of our lifetime. And in fact, the only thing we spend more time doing than working is sleeping.

[00:00:24] And yet, as Gallup's research shows, only around one in 10 people in the UK truly love the work they do. And that's the reason for this podcast to help the nine out of 10 who dread the thought of weekday mornings. I remember myself how that felt before I changed my own career story. So, if the thought of those weekday mornings fills you with dread, or that quiet voice keeps telling you there is something better waiting for you, why not join me for a conversation with an inspirational guest about how they've successfully changed their career?

[00:00:55] Full of ideas, strategies, and insights drawn from those real-life stories the Change Your Story Podcast will help you to discover your why and what else really matters to you so that you too can create a working life you love. 

[00:01:10] My name's Carolyn Parry, and I'm an award-winning career and life coach. And every fortnight I'll be joined by an inspirational guest for a conversation about their career journey, the highs, the lows, and the lessons they've learned, which I hope will inspire and entertain you as part of your journey to finding your "career why".

[00:01:29] Welcome to Change Your Story. 

[00:01:32] So it's my absolute pleasure to welcome Chris Jones today. For anybody listening to this based in Wales, you will know who Chris is if I say the S4C Weatherman or Chris the Weatherman. But for those outside Wales, Chris has been the face of the weather for nearly 30 years on S4C and these days is very much still a presenter and a host at events. He's a podcaster, he's been a radio presenter for Swansea Sounds and he's currently an ambassador for Prostate Cymru and also a trustee for Keep Wales Tidy. Chris, a very warm Croeso, welcome to you.

[00:02:02] Chris: Thank you very much for asking me..

[00:02:04] Carolyn: Now I know that you grew up just down the road from where I live, in a lovely seaside town, beautiful Georgian seaside town called Aberaeron, which overlooks Cardigan Bay on the beautiful West Wales coast. What was it like growing up in Aberaeron?

[00:02:19] Chris: I look back now and I didn't appreciate at the time, but growing up in Aberaeron was idyllic for want of a better word. It really was. It was, you know, a fantastic place to grow up near the sea. Obviously, the harbour, the beach, we were out on the boats, we were all fishing. It was just a lovely, lovely place to grow up.

[00:02:37] It was, uh, very community minded. You know, I played football and my father he had a printing business called Aeron Printers, in Aberaeron, and he literally started it from scratch, and my mother was the sister and then the matron of the Aberaeron Community Village Hospital. 

[00:02:54] Carolyn: I know you went to Aberaeron school, and you did Welsh, English and Geography for A Level, if my research is right,

[00:03:03] Chris: Yes, Welsh, because, I was from a Welsh speaking family, English, because I loved English as a subject and geography because it was my passion. Basically Geography was my best subject, and I had fantastic teachers, and, yeah, some good grades, in A Levels and then couldn't really wait to leave Aberaeron on as, as most 17, 18 olds do, really! Bonkers, really thinking back. But I went to university in Bangor, North Wales to do media, which was what I wanted to do. Simple as that, really.

[00:03:34] Carolyn: So isn't it interesting there you have this passion for geography, but you leave it as a passion. You go off and do media and then end up using the two later on, and we'll, we'll come onto that in a minute because your career in media started straight after graduating, didn't it?

[00:03:47] Chris: I had never been to Cardiff, even though it's what, two, two and a half hours from Aberaeron, never been here. So, I went down to Cardiff thinking, yeah, you're going to get a job. No worries whatsoever. But it didn't quite happen like that. I was a good 18 months basically looking for work. And this was in the days before the internet, obviously, before mobile phones, before computers basically.

[00:04:05] So it really was a matter of writing letters, which sounds so old-fashioned now. then going on my bike from Canton in Cardiff all the way down to the Bay and the square and the docks where all the TV companies were at that time, and literally knocking on doors, and trying to get in and being told where to go more than once, and that was a good 18 months of that, which was quite soul destroying. But I learned a lot. But then, after that, I had a job, not as anything fantastic, but I'm really glad that I did get this job, because it literally, told you from the ground up as it were, the bottom rung of the ladder. I got a job as a tea boy, It was for a sound production company called Echo Studios down in the docks, and it was fantastic because I got to know all kinds of people from every aspect of the media, And it was a great, great grounding and a great place to start, and again, I keep telling my, even my own kids, oh yeah, dad started off as a tea boy and they just looked at me.

[00:05:03] Tea boy. What? Making tea? Yeah and people just, they don't get that any more do they?

[00:05:10] Carolyn: Well, I think probably the concept of tea making is something that might have gone. What's interesting there is, I know the business still has the runner role as a way of getting in and understanding the business and providing all of that support, so in some ways changed and they're not making tea, but in other ways still doing that fundamental understanding how the business worked that you did. You talked about you learnt so much from it. Do you think it shaped who you are today?

[00:05:35] Chris: Oh, definitely without a shadow of a doubt. I wasn't just making tea obviously, and it was a runner role as well, and you've heard the story of, “go and get me a left-handed screwdriver”, it was a bit like that being sent out, to get all kinds of things.

[00:05:46] But I definitely learnt, from the bottom up and got to know people and I'm still in touch with some of the people I got to know back in, 1987, 88. But it definitely meant a lot to me and I'm quite proud of it actually, Carolyn, to say that I actually started right from the bottom, if you like.

[00:06:02] Carolyn: There's wisdom in starting the bottom because you know how it all works. When you start at the top, you can't make the same decisions without having understanding of how it all works and what the connections are and the levers and all the rest of it. So, starting the bottom makes total sense to me. You weren't just a runner though, were you? You moved forward into becoming a trainee cameraman and then a fully-fledged cameraman.

[00:06:23] Chris: Yeah. I was at Echo Studios for about 18 months. People were coming in all the time, and I got to know some of these. And they were quite well known people at that time, in the broadcast industry in Wales, called David Parry Jones and Peter Walker, Patrick Hannon and John Humphreys and John Humphreys obviously went onto, to become a well-known face and voice on BBC of course. And they said, "well, we are, we're starting this new company. It's a bit different from usual companies in Wales. It's a corporate company making corporate films, and also TV in documentaries, would you like to join us?" I thought, “err, yes!” So I got a job as an assistant cameraman and Carolyn, I can't stress enough how much it meant to me because that's what I wanted to do.

[00:07:03] You know, back in the university, I didn't really do much in the first and second year, but the third year I buckled down and I had the light bulb moment saying, “right, I would like to be a cameraman”. When they offered me a job as an assistant cameraman and to learn the trade with them, I thought I was in heaven. It was absolutely wonderful. And I joined Merlin Television. I was there for nearly 10 years and was very lucky to travel the world, as an assistant cameraman then and the cameraman, and then started directing and started,  doing all kinds of things.

[00:07:31] And I had some wonderful role models. and it was back in the days of three-hour lunches, flying in helicopters and traveling the world and, very, very lucky to travel Around Wales, around the UK, but also the world as well. 

[00:07:46]  Carolyn: You mentioned something really interesting there about you had a light bulb moment, about wanting to become a cameraman. How did you know?

[00:07:50] Chris: Well I was always interested in photography, even in school. But university, third year was all about TV camera work basically, and I remember to this day, they introduced us to these cameras. Now TV cameras back in those days were huge, heavy, cumbersome things. I remember looking at it: “Oh, okay, well this is why I'm here. this is why I'm in university. This is what I'd like to do.” So I, I really buckled down the third year, and used the cameras, got to know the techniques, learned a lot about lighting and lenses and that kind of thing. It really was a light bulb moment, sort of Eureka I haven't had many of those actually throughout my life.

[00:08:28] But that was definitely an Eureka moment: “Right, this is what I want to do.” I'm very, very lucky to be able to do so, you know.

[00:08:34] Carolyn: Do you know, I, I don't think you need many eureka moments do you in life? If you get one early enough that gives you the opportunity to get paid to do something you love and you're fascinated by and you're clearly passionate about to this day, you don't need many more of those. That's like winning the lottery, but in a different sense because we're going work for a very long time and being paid to do something you love is the best way to pass that time, I think. You said about 10 years working with them, didn't think about coming the other side of the camera, but that did actually happen for you, didn't it?

[00:09:01] Chris: Yes, it did. So one of the major contracts we as a company had was for the BBC, and Grandstand, remember the good old days of Grandstand and the World of Sport? We used to follow the British Bobsleigh team around the world circuit. If anybody's seen the film, Cool Runnings, about the Jamaican bobsleigh team had never seen snow and never done before in the Calgary Olympics. I was there and I was very lucky to be able to travel the world following this amazing British bobsleigh team along the world circuit, including Canada every year.

[00:09:34] I think it must have been 1991, we were in Saint Moritz in Switzerland. Now Saint Moritz is a different place and it's an incredible place, but the wealth was astounding, and we used to have a go on the bobsleigh, you know, you wouldn't be able to do it, now, health and safety wise, oh my word! But we used to have a go. I remember going in with the British team. and they were sponsored by Stellar Artois of all people. And I remember going out, with all the cameras and the kit and then right to the other side were about 19 crates of Stella Artois are being taken out to, to the team, but in Saint Moritz it was such an amazing place, I thought there's some great footage here, for S4C. Now, S4C had only been going for just over 10 years, actually not even 10 years and it was obviously the Welsh language channel, and I got to know a few of these people because we'd been doing documentaries in Welsh and English for them.

[00:10:26] So I remember phoning someone I knew, and said: "Oh, hi, it's Chris. I'm in Saint Moritz in Switzerland, there's some fantastic scenes here. Would you like me to film something and put down the line so you can do something with it? And they said: "Oh, yeah, that sounds like a great idea, but why don't you do something in front of camera as an intro?" I said, “Well, I can't do that, I'm a cameraman!” “Well, just try it.” I said, “Well, oh, okay." So, it literally was a matter of pressing the record button on the camera, running around the other side of the camera and saying something, I don't even remember what it was, and running back again, pressing stop, then sending it down the line. That's how the presenting actually started. Because when I came home two weeks after, I had a phone call, from the the head of presentation in S4C: "Would you like to come in and have a quick chat about, uh, presenting?” So I went down and they said, "Well, we've got a, an opening for a presenter." And I thought, oh, okay. "In the weather team. Do you know much about the weather?” and I remember blagging, "Yeah, yeah. I'm quite interested in the weather. Yeah, I'm really good." And not that I was at all, and I had no thoughts about going in front of the camera, but as you say, I did geography in A Level, part of which was all about meteorology. So, it sort of came back to me. And then in 1991, I was asked to join the weather presenting team of S4C, not knowing much about it to begin with. And it really was quite old fashioned because again, in the days before computers it was a magnetic map with little icons being stuck on the map and then falling off. And I remember going on top of the roof of the Met Office in Cardiff in my coat and my hat, because we were having the brief outside and watching the clouds come in. It was really bizarre. And then it changed, everything became computerized. So, I was there for, yeah, 29 years doing the weather and I was still working for Merlin as a cameraman, at least for the first five years, until I left completely, yeah.

[00:12:23] Carolyn: There's a couple of things are really, really interesting there. One is that sense of ‘say yes’ and then learn fast after to be able to do it.

[00:12:31] Chris: Oh, I say that all the time - say that all the time. And I haven't always been like that, but by now, I'm late fifties, I don't care. You just say yes, and you'll deal with that afterwards. But, looking back, that was pretty presumptuous of me and pretty cheeky me to say that I knew about the weather, because I literally didn't. As you do something, you get to know. And I took the exams and then I became a qualified presenter in meteorology. I'm not a meteorologist, never have been a meteorologist and not many weather presenters are. Basically, they're presenters first, then meteorologists, well, apart from the people on the BBC are mostly meteorologists first.

[00:13:05] But I came to know, and as I say, I had the qualifications, and I was quite lucky because I knew what happened behind the camera as well, so a foot in both worlds, if you like, in front and behind. So, I think it helped me, and maybe that would explain why I was doing it for 29 years. Who knows?

[00:13:22] Carolyn: I just wanted to go back to that moment when you went, “Yeah, I can do that” was that was a sense, a true sense of confidence in your own abilities rather than just blagging it?

[00:13:31] Chris: That's a good point actually, because I was in school  a bit of a show off, and into acting and singing and the eisteddfods were big in school, obviously, and I did amateur dramatics, and I was always on stage. And people were always saying, "oh yeah, Chris, he's going to be an actor. He's going to be, in front of the camera.” I love doing it, don't get me wrong. I love doing it, but it never really appealed to me. The camera work was always the first love. I suppose looking back now, when I got that request, and the offer, it might have triggered something in me. Oh yeah. Okay, I liked being, not the centre of attention, but I liked being in front of people so maybe there was a bit of confidence there as well. I wish I still have that confidence now.

[00:14:14] Carolyn: I think that's something that ebbs and flows and I think as you get older and events happened to you, that can knock your confidence. that came to mind as you were talking. The second thing that I think is interesting about what you said was that it sounds like there was a shift to a mix of employment and self-employment. Is that right?

[00:14:33] Yeah, there was, that was quite unusual at the time because I was working for Merlin obviously as a member of staff and they didn't really have to say yes, but when I went to them and said: "Listen, I've been offered this job. I won't, you know, impair on anything I do for you.” And it was mostly weekends and bank holidays anyway, the weather presenting to begin with, they said, "Yeah, absolutely no problem whatsoever." And looking back I think, oh my God, how lucky was I to have such understanding bosses and mentors, and they could see that it was something I really wanted to do. And it was good for them as well to have a little bit of a connection with the broadcaster as well. So, I was working for Merlin plus being self-employed with S4C. So, I was doing two jobs, if you like, but only for five years because in 1996 then, it became a bit too much, and, I was never home, because we were always out filming, obviously, and I was always missing birthdays and Christmases even, and anniversaries. And then as a result, my first marriage broke down. I'd become a father of two, two beautiful little girls by then. And I was missing a lot. I thought, oh God, this is silly. So I just said, "Right, it's time," and that was a scary, scary move, going freelance. I'll never forget that. In 1996, I remember going to one of my bosses and saying, "Right, I've decided to, uh, to go freelance." And they were very, very supportive. They even actually gave me a guarantee of a certain amount of work for the next six months just to get me going as I were. But it was still a scary moment, but since 1996, I've been self-employed basically. Yeah.

[00:16:11] Carolyn: So scary, but sometimes when we take a step that is a stretch, it's the very thing we need. When we stretch that comfort zone and we go, I'm going to say yes. I don't know if it's going to work, but something tells me I have to, and if we back ourselves, it comes good. And that's clearly what happened to you, Chris. It came good. You took the risk and they saw somebody with some talent they wanted to help and keep for a bit as well.

[00:16:31] Chris: Absolutely, I was very, very lucky to have such understanding bosses. But to come back to your point about self-employed being scary, yes, but, but I was never someone who liked, and it sounds very pompous, having someone who was telling me what to do all the time as it were. I wanted to be my own boss. And I think that's where the entrepreneur spirit, that's where the influence of my father came in, because obviously, he was an entrepreneur and a business owner himself, and I've had that entrepreneurial spirit, but obviously it was somewhere there in the back of my head, even before then.

[00:16:59] So it was a scary move, a big move, but the best move. The best move. I've always liked being in charge of my own destiny, if you like.

[00:17:07] Carolyn: It's very empowering, isn't it, when you're doing that. It does come with some worrying moments. You sort of go, "oh, it's a bit quiet at the I need think about..., oh, no. It'll be all right. Keep going."

[00:17:16] I still can't accept even now, after all these years that when the work's not there, it's okay. You know, it's okay not to have work. It's okay that the money's not coming in because things will improve, they always do. But I still get a massive lack of confidence and scary moments, but, it was the best thing I did, definitely. And I really couldn't, no, I couldn't really work for anyone else anymore.

[00:17:36] Carolyn: As you grow up hearing business around the table, I mean, we've got two kids that had two parents talking about running a business when they were growing up, and I know that went in and clearly it went in with you listening to your father talking around the kitchen table, no doubt, about running a business. So, I'm not surprised that you ended up going freelance. Apart from that sense of being your own boss, what else do you really value about being a freelancer?

[00:18:08] Chris: The fact that I can choose who I like to work for. By now, I only work with nice people. I don't want to work with idiots anymore. I've done that, and I like the fact that it's quite, quite freeing in every way, and when the work is there, don't get me wrong, it can be absolutely wonderful, lucrative, it can be absolutely fantastic. When the work is not there, obviously, it can be quite scary. but I love the fact that I can dip my toe into so many things. I have a so-called portfolio career, a finger in every pie. And I love that, love that. I never had that at the beginning, obviously. but I love the fact that I can try, I might fail, but try again, and then try another thing and try another thing. At the moment, I've got about, 4, 5, 6 different things going on, and, and I love the fact that it's not just one thing. And I think that's quite important to someone like me because I need to be kept interested, and I need to have that, spirit of trying, if you like. My wife and I had a cleaning company many years ago when my youngest daughter was very small, purely because. somebody asked us: "Do you know a cleaner? I'm desperate for a cleaner. I said: "No, I don't know a cleaner.” And then I remember asking my wife: "Why don't we start a cleaning company?" And she said:, "Okay". So we started a cleaning company, but it failed. We were there for four or five years, but we just couldn't get the staff. And that's another story.

[00:19:30] Chris: But then it went by the by, but then we started something else. So it's all a method of yes, being scared but not too scared that you were afraid to try, you know, and you can't be afraid of failing. And I know it's a hard thing to accept, that failing. It really is. And I've learned that over the years.

[00:19:45] Carolyn: I think you're right. It is something that everybody who runs a business has a moment where things just don't work for whatever reason, but normally there's a gift within that failure that helps you move forward and stronger and better onto the next thing. I'm interested in a number of things you've said and just pulling those together really. You've talked on the one hand about the sort of feast versus famine of self-employment and every person will know that's run a business, there are moments when you just have a surfeit of things to do.

[00:20:11] And you talked on the other hand about the challenges of work-life balance that you faced that led to the breakdown of your first marriage. How do you square off feast and work-life balance in a way that doesn't feel like you're compromising all around perhaps.

[00:20:26] Chris: Yeah, that's a tough one, really. I think there's a lot in me and obviously a lot of freelancers and self-employed that you can't say no. And it's not so much now, but in the early days, I said yes to everything, literally everything. And I soon realized that, okay, if you're going go freelance, you can't do that. You've got to be strong. You've got to be a little bit ruthless with yourself and say, right, unless you say no, nothing will change. Again, you'll never be home. Again, you'll never have a successful relationship. And again, you'll never spend the time with your kids, blah, blah, blah. So, it took a while. It took a while, but over time, as you get to know people and get to know the kind of thing you like to do, you learn to say no, or you learn to say, right, not this time, and you learn to spend time with the family, with the kids, with your parents. It's hard. It really is hard, I think, but I think it's very important that you do so, otherwise being freelance could be even worse than being employed for somebody don't really respect. So, it can be difficult. Yeah, it can be difficult, but I even now, I mean, you know, as I say, I’m 58, and I've been doing this for so many years. I can say, right, I don't really want to do that anymore. But then there's a part of me saying, well, okay, I've got to do it because at the end of the day, I've got to pay the mortgage and bills like everybody else. And there's always that financial worry on your shoulders thing, right? If I don't do this, I won't be able to do this. And if I don't take that on, I won't be able to do that. So, it's just, it's a constant battle. It is a constant battle.

[00:21:57] Carolyn: I often refer to that little thing on the shoulders, the parrot that's in your head that's pecking away and going: "Oh, but be careful if you do that, there's going to be a problem.” How do you deal with that parrot?

[00:22:06] Chris: Not very well sometimes. Do you know what that parrot is? And with all respect to him, that's my father. That's my father saying all the time: ""Why aren't you doing this?" Because of his background, because he worked, you know, literally every hour God sent, because of running the business and everything and starting the business from nothing. That's my father saying, "Right, okay, well, you know how much you get paid for that and what are you going to do next and how are you going pay for this? And, you know, if you don't work, if you don't do this…". So, there's always Eric the parrot on my shoulder.

[00:22:37] Carolyn: So Eric's got a name, well, the Parrot's got a name now. It might be worth just giving Eric a hug every now and then and say, "It's all right. I'm going to just stroke your feathers and it'll all be okay." So there you are. You've been the face of the weather for S4C for 29 years. That's brought you some opportunity, hasn't it? What sort of things did it enable you to do as a result?

[00:22:58] Chris: Oh, absolutely, it gave me all kinds of opportunities I did quite a few things on TV, obviously, other jobs. I presented everything from gardening programs to fashion programs. and then as you get little bit of a profile, and you get more well known, you get invited to all kinds of things, and you get the chance to take part in quiz shows, and panel shows.

[00:23:22] And then I did a bit of radio on Radio Wales, Radio Cymru. And then, I was asked to contribute to a few magazines. And they just love the fact that, you know, it's Chris Jones, the Welsh Weatherman, or the Weatherman. There seems to be a fascination about weather presenters. I'm not quite sure what it is but I had my own radio show then on Swansea Sounds, that was later 2016. I'm not a guy who goes on and on and on about me, me, me, and I'm very conscious of sounding a bit pompous, that being Chris Jones the Weatherman was my life, basically. It gave me so much, not only financially, but as a profile, it gave me all kinds of opportunities to get to know people. I did interviews with Anthony Hopkins and Michael Sheen and, Sian Lloyd and everyone really, so purely because I was the weatherman. So, it meant a lot and it gave me a lot, until it all went away, of course, but that's another story. 

[00:24:19] Carolyn: And we'll come to that in a minute because I know that you were doing quite a bit of giving back when you were a weatherman as well. was something in particular, you did which was about highlighting an issue that then became something that was important in your own life, wasn't there?

[00:24:32] I was a cameraman as well, was still doing obviously freelance work as well as the weather. I was directing children's programs, I was directing gardening programs. I was directing corporates, adverts, sponsorships things, all kinds of things really, the awards work hadn't really started by that, but I was still working as a bit of a cameraman and also a presenter. So I was invited to go walking and filming at the same time and being paid to do it. It was incredible. So, I went to China. I went to Chile, did the Appalachian Trail, Mont Blanc in Europe, and over Wales as well to present programs about these certain charities, one of which was Velindre and Velindre is quite well known here in Wales. It's basically a cancer charity, which is quite big by now. And they asked me to go to, Chile, first of all, and then, Mont Blanc. I was filming promotion material for them as well. and it's quite ironic in a anyway, that several years after I did a fundraising walk in Peru for Velindre, because my father-in-law had passed away with cancer and he'd had treatment in Velindre as a lot of people do in this part of the world. So yeah, so that came full circle. That was an amazing experience as well, going to Peru to raise money, for the charity that obviously my father-in-law had benefited from, but I was still Chris Jones the Weatherman doing that, but filming as well.

[00:25:52] So again, I'm so lucky to be able to do that kind of thing. So, to answer your question, that's what being the Weatherman in front of camera did for me really. It gave me all these opportunities.

[00:26:02] Carolyn: And opportunities that you were open to and always keen to say yes to. And of course, Velindre's very well known, not least in the moment because that's where Rhod Gilbert has been, having his help for his current cancer challenges. And I'm sure everybody would wish Rhod all the very best. And he's also, interestingly, he was an ambassador for Velindre before he became one of their patients. 

[00:26:24] So a chance to do something quite phenomenal from something that you'd like doing anyway, which is taking that love of media, the love of camera, the love of presenting, overlaying the geography with it, and then being able to get all sorts of new opportunities. And of course, in 2016, you touched on it earlier, an opportunity to become a radio presenter.

[00:26:45] Chris: Yeah. Do you know what? I've always loved radio. I remember when I was in school, I did hospital radio for a couple of years, and I thought I was the business, I really did. It was in Glangwili Hospital in Carmarthen and it was a late night show. I remember, and I'd just learned to drive. I remember the drive from Aberaeron out to Carmarthen, then doing this little radio show in Glangwili and I thought it was brilliant and it sort of planted a seed, I think of radio even then, but obviously that didn't happen for the next few years because of TV and presenting and camera. And then, yeah, in 2016, again, purely because I was, not well known but had a bit of a profile here in Wales, I suppose. I was asked to join the Swansea Sounds team. Now, the Swansea Sounds is, or was longest running commercial radio station in the whole of Wales, if not the UK actually, and a lot of people have started presenting on Swansea Sounds. So. I was asked to come on board and, and I'd never done proper radio as it were, but I was given a few days training. I thought I was just going press a couple of buttons and present, and somebody else would do the leg work as it were. But no, it was all down to me. So, it was all self-run and self-operated. So, I had a three hour weekly show on Swansea Sounds, and they gave me carte blanche to do anything I wanted, really. I played any music I wanted. I loved playing new tracks. And then I had people in as guests, and then we started recording guests as well, and I used all my list of contacts I'd had, you know, up to then and had, entrepreneurs. I had well-known people. I had politicians, I had ministers and all kinds of things. I loved every second of Swansea Sounds. Absolutely loved it. 

[00:28:24] It was between seven and 10 in the evening on Tuesday night, and it was a bit of a dead show before I came. And then because of the kinds of things I brought in and made it a bit informal, if you like, and brought these well-known people along, the listing figures rocketed, they really did. That was fantastic. And, I loved it. I wish I could do that again.

[00:28:43] Carolyn: You never know, Somebody might be listening to this and go, come on Chris, we need someone new!

It's interesting you talk about hospital radio I know a lot of people have gone from hospital radio into a radio career, haven't they? It's almost like the traditional path if you like, and I know that a three hour show is not an hour's worth of prep time, is it? It's several hours more than that to prep. How long did it take you to prep a three-hour show?

[00:29:04] I prepped in as much as I knew the music tracks I wanted to play. It was almost as if I finished on a Tuesday, by Wednesday morning I was planning the next week already just by getting the music tracks and looking for new music and then thinking of my next guest. And by the time I got in on the following of Tuesday, it was all ready to go. And, but, it was live, so, it was a real learning curve, but I loved it. I really did.

[00:29:28] Carolyn: And it gave you, I suspect, a little bit of time to do some other things as well. because you don't sit still, do you, the grass does not grow on Chris Jones, I don't think, because at 2016 you started adding another string to your bow as well, didn't you? You referenced fashion earlier on and this was a fashion related activity, wasn't it?

[00:29:46] Chris: Yeah, yeah, it was. Well, fashion in the loosest sense of the, word maybe, but again, I came to know someone who had a string of shops, and they did the gifts, Welsh gifts and a bit of everything. So, we said, "Well, why don't we come up with a range of products, gifts, with a weather theme with your logo on it." “Yeah! Why not?" So, we came up with a logo, and then we started with mugs all with a weather theme, weather related, mugs. We had umbrellas, we had aprons, tea towels, posters, welcome mats. What else did we do? All kinds of things. they went really, really well.

Because of that then I thought, it's time to move on with another thing. And I came to know a company called Corgi Hosiery. Now Corgi is a very, very well-known company, in the sock world if you like. And would you believe that the CEO's name was Chris Jones. We met each other at some event, and we found out we had the same name. And he said, " Err, do you fancy coming on board and doing a range of socks. We're always looking for like, novelty, you know, fun socks." I said, "Yeah, okay, great." I came up with a few drawings on paper for five different kinds of weather to go on socks for men and ladies. There was sun and rain, snow, thunderstorms, and rainbow. I gave them to their designer, and their designer came up with these amazing looking designs on socks, and they were called the Welsh Weatherman Range. And they still sell. They still sell, not only on their website, on my website, but in shops all over country.

[00:31:24] I've sold pairs to Justin Trudeau, the Canadian Prime Minister. I've sold pairs to South Africa, London, a shop in Cornwall, what else? Ireland all over Wales. any show, eisteddfods and I gave them out as raffle prizes now and again and that kind of thing. So, it's been wonderful. And people still ask for the socks.

[00:31:48] Chris: Christmas time is very popular, obviously. And then you've got Mother's Day, Father's Day, and that's it really. Then it was summer. Nobody wants to buy a pair of socks. But they are very well known in certain circles, if you like. And Corgi obviously is a big, big name. I mean, I'm small potatoes compared to some of the things they do for Harrods and Gant and J Crew but, they seem to like it, so, we're still making them anyway.

[00:32:12] Carolyn: Keep making them. If people are buying, you know you've got something going there that's going well. Now it's all been going very well so far. We've had Chris Jones the Weatherman, that's all been going well. We've got great opportunities to do all sorts of things for charities. You've got the radio stuff happening and then suddenly life decides it's going to throw you a couple of curve balls from 2018 to 2020 odd. And those curve balls are quite big curve balls in the realm of work and health.

[00:32:39] Chris: Yes. yeah, do you know what? The last few years have been quite tough, to be honest with you, but 2018, I was diagnosed with an enlarged prostate. I'd been out to celebrate my birthday in Aberaeron, actually, in the Harbourmaster Hotel. And without putting too fine upon it, I'd had one too many to drink, let's put it that way. And I remember going back to my parents' house and not been able to pass water for 24 hours. I think, “Okay, something really, really wrong here.” Obviously, a great deal of pain and then rushed up to Bronglais hospital and diagnosed with an enlarged prostate, which I'd never even heard of. I didn't really know what the prostate was at that time, and then dealt with that, lived with that, I suppose for a couple of years and having all kinds of issues with water retention and, you know, blood in the urine and, affecting me, affecting me mentally as well because I knew I couldn't drink too much volume of anything because I'd have issues with water retention and, and my confidence just ebbed away, didn't want to socialize, didn't want to go anywhere. I knew the toilets on the M4 motorway extremely well because I knew I needed to stop and I knew where the next nearest toilet was as it were. But after one incident then, funnily enough coming out of Swansea Sounds, I had water attention and in so much pain. But I remember driving to the hospital, and they said, "Right, come on, we got to do something about this.” And in six weeks time I had green laser surgery, in Bridgend Hospital in the Princess of Wales here in South Wales, for an enlarged prostate. And it was basically reducing the size of the prostate from a very large prostate to a much smaller prostate, thereby, improving the symptoms as it were, which is great. And it worked really well. 

[00:34:30] And then I went back for the check-up in six weeks’ time and they said, "Well, the prostate's fine, but you've got cancer cells". “Ah, right. Okay.” So, I was diagnosed then with early stages prostate cancer which I've still got. 

[00:34:47] And then things started happening, as you say, work-wise. The Swansea Sounds show came to an end because they were taken over by this huge conglomerate based in Germany. I think they are based, and closed a few stations down. so that was one off the list as it were, which is really, really disappointing. And in 2020 then, which obviously was a big year for a lot of people because of Covid and everything, it really did go pear shaped, because as well as being diagnosed with the early stages prostate cancer, which I accept and it's early stages, and I live with it. I was then, what's the word? Elbowed, pushed, bullied, I suppose out of my weather presenting job, which was almost, if not worse, than having prostate cancer, which sounds a bit daft but, as you can imagine, 29 years of doing the same job and then all of a sudden not doing it, it really was like losing a member of family. And that really affected me mentally. a lot of goalposts were moved and, lawyers were involved and all kinds of legal implications. And in the end, I remember my wife saying the second time I woke up in the middle of the night sweating and crying, and I thought: "Hmm, this is not good, is it? This is not good. Uh, I've just got to let it go. I just got to let it go." So I remember going in and saying: "Right, if you don't want me, you don't want me. Forget solicitors. I won't get into the details obviously, but they told me that I just didn't fit in with their plans, as simple as that, so in 2020, I lost my job as the weather presenter as well.

[00:36:24] So that was a triple whammy. There's the Swansea Sounds, the weather and the fact that I was diagnosed with prostate cancer. So the prostate cancer, I live with. It's still early stages. I've learned a lot. I've come to know a lot. I've become an ambassador for this wonderful charity called Prostate Cymru. I do a lot of volunteer work for them. Not just awards and ceremonies, but I do walks for them. I even volunteer in stands and, you know, shows, so I do a lot of work for them. And I have a regular PSA blood test, every six or seven weeks, which is about the only test really for men to have for prostate cancer. I have an MRI every quarter, every four months, and at the moment, touch wood, it's below a certain level if you like to do something about it. So, I'm on active surveillance as many men in my position are. So, as long as you keep an eye on it and are proactive and go back and check, and check and check, then you should be okay, because when the time does come, there are at least four, if not five options to cure the cancer completely. But if you don't, if you're not proactive, or if you're not the kind of person who will go and have a PSA or, you know, digital examination or anything like that, as we've heard with Bill Turnbull and a few others, if you're too busy to go and check this out, then it might be too late. 

[00:37:41] So that's the big message of Prostate Cymru. Don't leave it until it's too late. So, yeah, 2020 was a horrible year. It was a horrible year in every way. and obviously I wasn't the only one because of Covid and everything. Luckily, we didn't lose anyone, but it's been over two years now and just over two years. So, I'm only just accepting it, to be quite honest with you. I'm only just accepted it. Swansea Sounds I've accepted, disappointed. Uh, the cancer, it is what it is. It is what it is. I can't, literally can't, do anything about it, but the weather is literally taken me just over two years to accept it, that I'm not on camera anymore, that I'm not the presenter, that I'm not Chris Jones, the Weatherman, even though even though I'm still being asked to contribute on radio and in articles about the weather. So, yeah.

[00:38:30] Carolyn: You've clearly gone through the ringer, and I will say at this point, I lost my father to prostate cancer, so I understand a little bit about, where you are and what you've gone through.

[00:38:38] And what's great about where you are is you are actually being proactive. So, in the cancer context, you've got something you can do about it. And that's empowering and that's I think one of the things that helps you deal with it, is that you know it is to an extent within your control. The acceptance of the Swansea situation - that happens in mergers and takeovers and there's not a lot one can do about that apart from go through a little bit of the grief curve, you know, Elizabeth Kubler Ross's Grief Curve, the five stages of accepting a big change. Interesting listening to you as well talking about the loss of the weatherman role because that I think was very much firmly embedded as part of your identity.

[00:39:16] It's Chris Jones weatherman. It's not Chris Jones sock seller. It's not Chris Jones charity fundraiser. It's Chris Jones weatherman. And so I can really understand because our career is a very big part of our identity because when somebody says,: "What do you do?" We don't reply with: "I do this", we reply with: "I am A", which is the clue that it's identity based.

[00:39:42] And so when something significant happens that rattles your sense of identity, it takes a while to recover because we built a lot around that identity from the minute we meet somebody to the way we act, to the things we do, to how we earn our income. So it's no surprise to me that it's taken you two years. I've worked a lot with people who've gone through a redundancy or been bullied out or whatever. And actually it's far better for employers to be just very straightforward and say:" "Look, the reason this doesn't work is because..", rather than any sort of round the back door shenanigans, just be honest and say: "This is the problem. This is how we're going to have to solve it. We know that's difficult for you. Here's how we're going to support you to transition into something better for you or, or something different for you." But in time, it hopefully will become better because that gives you that sense of hope and optimism. You know, losing something that's such a key part of your identity is almost like having a bereavement, but you can't mourn in the same way because you don't have a sense of what and why you're feeling like you are.

[00:40:38] Chris: When I was told that I wasn't part of the weather presenter's role were, you start to think: “Right, okay, is it me that means what have I been doing for the last 29 years?" And, and my self-worth just disappeared. My self-confidence disappeared and I felt a complete joke, you know, a complete joke. After 29 years, floored! "What the hell have I been doing for 29 years?

[00:41:03] Chris: And all of a sudden I'm told I'm not good enough". So it makes you, it makes you really, really think, "Okay, what have I been doing?" And then, as I say, it really did affect my, my self-worth, my self-confidence, and I went downhill quite fast, actually. Yeah, in a few ways. Uh, and it's still quite difficult to talk about, but, by now, Yyu know, I've just got to accept it. Otherwise, uh, I'll never get over it. But you are right. It was part of my identity and all of a sudden it wasn't there. But as I say, funnily and ironically, I'm still known as Christ Jones, the weatherman. And I'm still getting work because of it. Maybe not in TV, but I'm getting work as an awards host for conferences and, you know, we worked together up in North Wales and I'm still getting work because at one time I was Chris Jones the weatherman . So, so, and I think: "Okay, right. In that case, I must have done something right. I must be quite good. I must be not too bad for them to still think that." It's just the employers that took it over maybe didn't think that, which is fine, you know.

[00:42:09] Carolyn: But it hasn't stopped you developing a new identity, has it? And we'll come onto that. But just before we do, I just want to spend just a little bit of time now because clearly people listening to this can hear the impact it's had on you, but they can also hear your spirit. What is it you've done to get yourself to feel better because clearly much of the time, except when I take you back to that miserable place, much of the time, you are quite resilient now and quite resigned. And you've said you've accepted it. What's helped you achieve that? Because obviously there's been going through sort of a loss of belonging, and all of that stuff. What's helped you achieve a better sense of mental health since then?

[00:42:49] Chris: Well, do you know what? Very simply, talking. It's as simple as that. And I, you know, men are hopeless. We're hopeless about talking about our bits, our private bits, we don't do that - men. And men don't talk about mental health as well. But I suddenly realised, well, okay, I've got to do something about this. And I went to see a counsellor for want of a better word. Uh, yeah, she was a counsellor and a therapist, through somebody else I knew, and I started talking to her. And oh my God, that helped. It helped so much. And that's what we are trying to get across with Prostate Cymru as well, that men need to talk each other and to the experts and to the nurses and, but with mental health as well. and obviously it's become a big subject over the last three, four years, hasn't it because of Covid and everything else. But I suddenly realized I've got to talk, um, and I poured it out as I'm pouring out now, to this lovely, lovely lady who, I met once a week for six, seven weeks. and by doing so, it helped me put things a little bit into perspective thinking, "Oh, for God, Chris, just get over it. You know, just get over it and move on." And I have by now, and I moved on to other things just about though, just about.

[00:44:00] Carolyn: I was going say, I could hear an echo of Eric, the parrot there. "Come on Chris, just get over it.” But you started rebuilding your identity and of course Covid meant that everybody's career went into some significant challenging periods, and a moment of real stress, and yet you used that moment well because you used it to pivot and you took all the skills you had to start to do stuff online. Tell us a bit about that.

[00:44:24] Chris: Yeah. Again, because of what was happening, we were spending more and more time, obviously, at home and at the time, everybody seemed to have a podcast. And I remember sitting down and doing a lot of research and putting YouTube videos, and obviously my wife and I were both at home and the kids had gone by then they'd all left because we had an empty nest and thinking, right, we've got to do something. apart from the weather, which we were still doing, there's nothing else. So, okay, what should I do? I thought, “Oh, I quite fancy doing a little radio thing, a podcast. And as simple as that I just started my own podcast. I started in English one, first of all, and I spent a bit of money on, on the kit, on the recording stuff and microphones, and I built myself a little studio, which is where I am now, and recorded once a month an English podcast called The Influencers with people who I think were changing and shaping and influencing our daily lives and, you know, in every way. So, I started off with domestic abuse and then LGBT and then a charity, homelessness, I did entertainment and politics and bit of everything.

[00:45:27] And then started a Welsh language one as well because I am primarily obviously, you know, a well speaker, and took advantage of Chris Jones, the Weatherman thing again, every week. And it's been going up for the last three years and I've done over 150 guests and it goes out on Spotify and Apple and Google and webcast and all kinds of, platforms, apart from BBC Sounds - that's another world. It's just an informal chat show, we have 10 questions. We have a bit of a quiz. We have a laugh. And, most people have said, "God, that was really good. You've got me talking about things I've never talked about." I mean, one celeb came out as being gay. And he's, he's never done that before. One lady who's quite a well-known actress, started to break down crying because she started talking about how she lost her mother and that kind of thing. So, so it was almost like a therapy session.

[00:46:11] Carolyn: I think what's interesting is when you give people time and space to talk and it comes with a real sense of genuine connection, people open up and I'm not surprised that people open up to you, Chris, because you have that sort of ability to make people feel at ease and talk. Having seen you in action hosting, you get people talking and opening up and that sense of connection I think is particularly important to you. I think one of your gifts is actually that relationship with people, isn't it?

[00:46:37] Chris: Yeah, I think so. I think you're right. I didn't realize I did have that, to be quite honest with you. I didn't realize I did have that skill, if, if that's the word. But I think you're right. I think you're right. I think that's what makes my one a little bit different is that I can empathize, I can sympathize, I can put people at ease, I think, well, that's what they keep telling me, and I enjoy it. I've just done one this morning with a lovely young lady from Brunai. She came up to Wales and she's learned Welsh. and she's making a bit of a name for herself on, social media. And I thought: "My God, if I wasn't doing that podcast, I would never come across something like that. And it's wonderful. I've done Hugh Edwards and Sean Lloyd and a few quite well-known faces and names and voices, but it's nice to give a little bit of a push, if you like, and a bit of profile to someone like her, and I do musicians, and I love, I love it every week. and it's really, really good. So, it's meant a lot to me and I'm so glad I started it. and again, it's an extra, extra feather in the cap.

[00:47:35] Carolyn: I think what's interesting listening to you talk there is actually we very often don't know what we can do so easily that others can't. And that's the question really is: "What's the thing I do so easily I can't understand why others can't do it.?" That's the sort of the oxygen, the mental oxygen that we breathe, if you like. And everybody has that ability. They just need to find out what it is and then put it to work. And that's exactly what you've done with the podcast, which is why people open up to you, and obviously talking and listening are, key skills, and I'd go as far as to say a passion that you have for getting underneath the hood of something, someone, a story.

[00:48:11] And of course you've taken that forward now, haven't you, that that sense of conversation and guiding and educating and informing and conversation generally with the latest thing that you're doing. Your current venture, which actually picks up on a word we've talked about a lot today in various guises is, which is walking.

[00:48:29] Chris: Yes, yes indeed. I was always a walker and as I said earlier on, very lucky to walk in amazing places like Chile and Peru, and China. and I live in little place called Ogmore by Sea, which is basically a seaside village in the Vale of Glamorgan in South Wales. I'm literally a stone's throw from the beach, and I'm out walking every day in my life with a dog along the cliffs, and on the beach, and it's been great. So I thought: "Well, okay, how can I use that passion as a business, if you like?" and I've started doing guided walks, not only in this area, but in other parts of Wales as well, but not just guided walks, Carolyn, oh no. Not just walking from A to B, that'll be boring. So what I'm doing is trying to introduce, bit of history, a bit of wellbeing, a lot of food and drink, with talks plus characters. So, if, for example, we are doing a walk along the cliffs in the Vale and there's a certain history about ghosts or pirates or monks or something like that, well, I get an actor in and he or she dresses up as the character and they appear on the walk, on the path as the walkers pass by. And I tell you, it makes such a difference to have that little bit of extra interest and they keep on coming back. So, I've got one, in March. I've got some in May and June, but I've also started, I suppose an extra even element again of guiding throughout Wales. I had an American gentleman join me at the beginning of the year who'd never been to Wales before, and he wanted to see Wales. I said: "All right, okay, well great. How much money have you got?" And he said, oh, and he gave me a budget. And I asked: "How much time have you got?" " Four days." I thought: "Oh, okay, well you're not going to see Wales in four days." I don't think he quite realized how far it was and how long it took from A to B, you know that, but, that was great. So I'm doing, another guided, tour, a driven tour with, accommodation sorted and everything else. An extra second string to the bow, but I love it. I love talking to people. I love walking. but it's the extra elements and I'm supporting local businesses, supporting local pubs and food producers and coffee producers. We've been from gin distilleries, to cider makers, we've been to lava bread makers, we've been cockle picking, so there's everything across the board. And it is going to be really busy from March onwards.

[00:50:42] Carolyn: I think that's lovely because what that's doing is it's pulling all that Welsh flavour through again, and what would you expect from Chris Jones with a name like Jones? It's going to have to have that sort of feel to it, isn't it!. It's absolutely going to have to have that feel, and presumably good for your mental health as well.

[00:50:56] Chris: Oh, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, again, during Covid and during that awful time in 2022, two things saved my life. I think, well, three things. Talking and we've talked about that. Walking without a shadow of a doubt and the dog. Those three things saved my life, yeah. Without sounding dramatic, they really, really did. I mean, talking for obviously reasons, obvious reasons, walking because, and I had to walk because the dog needed walking. It got you out of the house. It got you on the cliffs in the wind and the rain or whatever. So they really, really, really helped. And even more recently, and I think we talked about in a second, something else has saved my wellbeing, if you like, but walking is brilliant. It's so good for so many people in so many ways. not only just physically obviously, but mentally with your wellbeing, you get time to think. I don't walk with headphones listening to music. I don't want that. Some people do that. I mean, they just switch off with that.

[00:51:52] But I literally want to hear everything around me, and I want to feel everything around me. So, I want to be aware, I want to be conscious of what I'm doing every second, so I don't walk listening to music, which some people find quite strange. And the dog. I mean, you know, my dog is my favourite child and I got four children.

[00:52:07] Carolyn: Don't tell them! What you described there is almost like a walking meditation when you are totally present and listening and tuning in and there's a huge healing power in nature, isn't there? It just heals when you can get out and get out of yourself and focus on things around you rather than focus internally. And I can understand why that's worked for you. Is it that walking from 2020 onwards that got you into the Keep Wales Tidy trustee work that you do now?

[00:52:34] Chris: Yes. Again, I was invited to go for an interview as a trustee on the board of Keep Wales Tidy, which was a big honour for me because, you know, why would they? They asked me to go along and they obviously knew of my knowledge in certain areas like marketing and promotion and obviously broadcasting and, all kinds of contacts, and it's been great. It's been really good. I love it. Keep Wales Tidy have been going for quite a few years now, and they do so much amazing work, not only on beaches and, parks and litter picking and that kind of thing, but they try to shape law, they try to shape government thinking in regards to plastic bags and, everything from to rivers to oceans to beaches. And it's been wonderful dealing and sitting down with people once a month from all walks of life and contributing as much as I think I can really. And, it's been lovely. Yeah.

[00:53:25] Carolyn: And another facet, of course, of your love of geography in a way, connecting right back to the early love of geography when you did it for A Level. And you've got another love that's coming up now, haven't you? 

[00:53:27] Yes, absolutely. And do you know what? We've talked about all kinds of things, but this thing is probably one of the best decisions I've ever made. And I'm not being too dramatic, because I've just joined a male voice choir. Now, when I was asked, I was in my local pub hosting a night for the outgoing owners and we had speeches, and we had a bit of music, and I made a couple of speeches and just hosting the whole thing. And then I went to the toilet as men do, and I was standing there and the door opened and this gentleman walked in and stood next to me and he looked at me and, you know, "”ow's it going?" And he said, "Oh, you've got a good voice then mate. Good voice. You ever sung?" and I was thinking, “Well, no, I'm, I'm trying to do my business here, hello.” And he said, "Oh, you'd be a good baritone. Come and join Bridgend Male Voice Choir. I said, “No, it's not, it's not really my thing. "Well, okay, come on, we meet every Thursday night." "Okay." Anyway, so I went home that evening, told my wife, she laughed and she said, "Well, why don't you just go and see. You love singing.” I'd recorded. I was given the opportunity as the weatherman to record songs with well-known people here in Wales, Heather Jones especially, and they're still available on iTunes and they play on the radio, She said, "Well, go and give it a go. You love singing." And I used to sing in school, I was never a member of a choir. So anyway, I went along one Thursday evening thinking, "Oh, well, you know, I'm far too young, surely" I went along and as soon as they started singing, there was about 65 men in one room, and they started singing Oh my God. And it was almost an eureka moment, again. The hairs just stood up in the back of my neck and my arms and I thought, "Oh! This sounds incredible." And I was obviously aware of male voice choirs, being Welsh. And I thought, "Right, okay, I'll give it a go." And that was March last year, and it's one of the best things I've ever done. I love singing. I love singing what we sing. I love the camaraderie, I love the community thing of it all. I've had such a welcome. I'm nearly the youngest there. Not quite nearly, but they're a wonderful, wonderful bunch of guys. And, they've got engagements and events from weddings to concerts to quite high profile concerts. And we've done the Elvis festival, we're doing the Pride march in Cardiff. We're going on tour to Cornwall and North Wales and Ireland. And I love it. So, singing again has saved me, but certainly added lot. Oh God, a lot. It's, it's enriched my life and it sounds very dramatic, but you've got to be there, I think and hear that wall of sound and we sing everything from  Welsh hymns to Elvis, basically.

[00:56:13] As a fellow singer, I get it totally. There is community. There's a moment isn't there when you sing and everybody's aimed and focused on the one thing and there's some magic sensation that ripples through the choir and you just feel that coming together and it all moving forward.

[00:56:27] And that's what we've been exploring today, Chris, really, it all coming together and moving forward. From the very early days, and I make no apologies for having said, "let's explore your very early years. Where did it all start?" Because in a career sense, that's where it all did start. It started that sense of community at school.

[00:56:44] The eisteddfodau - for those who are wondering what eisteddfodau are, the festivals of music and, drama and words and so forth, through that love of geography, the influence of your father in particular with his printing business, the moving towards media, the discovery of the love of the camera, front and back. Taking that forward to being a household face for years, the disruption that you've regrouped from so well. And I think that's the thing I would say to you is focus on how much you have rediscovered and have started developing yourself afresh from that disruptive moment.

[00:57:20] And sometimes things have to break and fall away for you to move forward to something better. And there's the whole thing around Japanese pottery, isn't there, when the pot breaks and the breakages are filled with gold, the seams of gold, and that being seen as being so much richer than the pot originally was.

[00:57:34] And I can see from you, you've discovered a whole pile of things since that moment and that those massive challenges to you. You've risen to those challenges and you've come back all the stronger with so many more interesting things ahead of you. It'd be interesting to see where your journey takes you next.

[00:57:51] But for now, thank you ever so much because it's been a fascinating time having a conversation with you. But before we finish, you know that question I'm going to ask because I ask at the end of every episode. Is there a theme tune or a video or a quote or something that always keeps you going?

[00:58:06] I'm a big fan of the Eagles and, and Joe Walsh especially as their lead guitarist as well, and I was very lucky to see them last year. It's been a big, big dream of mine to see that the Eagles and my wife got me a ticket to go and see them, we both went down to Hyde Park last year. But there's one song that means a lot and we play it constantly.  T t's called "Life's been good to me so far", and even though all this nonsense has been hitting me the last few years, it really has. Life really has been good to me so far. And I always kid with my kids saying, at my funeral, I'd like you to play please: "Life's been good to me so far" by Joe Walsh.

[00:58:45] Carolyn: Well, let's hope that that moment is a very, very, very long way ahead in the future. Chris, I'm really looking forward to seeing what other magical things you concoct out of the spirit and the ingenuity and the creativity that is Chris Jones. Thank you very much today. Diolch yn fawr iawn. Look after yourself, stay safe and well.

[00:59:03] Chris: Thank you. Thank you, diolch yn fawr. 

[00:59:06] Carolyn: We know deep down if what we're doing is right, we all have a voice. That quiet voice that knows what's good for us, the voice within which expresses disquiet. The trick is to listen to that voice, to trust it, and to take our courage in both hands so that we can move in the direction of something new  which calls to us. As the saying goes, we can't be what we can't see until something in someone else's story inspires us to take the next step, to try something new, to adventure.

[00:59:38] If this episode has helped you to do just that, to change your story in some way, then please share it in the show notes that go with it on your social media channels so it can help others that you know too, to escape from a job they hate and find a career they love. I do hope you'll join me next time when we'll be hearing from another inspirational guest to help you continue to change your story for the better.

See you soon.